Art De La Guerre

AlanCutner · Tribun Inscrit le: 03 Nov 2014 Messages: 747 Localisation: Scotland

In the diagram below units A and B are facing enemy units X and Z. A and Z are in frontal contact, with unit B in frontal contact with the flank of Z. Unit X is facing down, not currently engaged.

AAZZ
AAZZ..XXXX
AAZZ..XXXX
AAZZ
....BBBB
....BBBB

Can unit X charge that part of the front of unit B that extends out past the rear of unit Z? If so how do the units conform, and does it cancel the flank contact on Z.

I've been playing that the frontal charge is not allowed, but if B were charged on its flank or rear (not possible from current position of X) it would have to turn, therefore removing the flank contact on Z

fdunadan · Tribun Inscrit le: 12 Juin 2009 Messages: 984

No, X can't charge B cause it will not be able to conform with B.
an easy way to solve this kind of problem is to considere that all units are square: if Z was a Chariot, Artillery or Elephant, it will not leave B with some space on his front and therefore X couldn't charge.

and yes, if B is contacted from rear or flank, it is no more in contact with Z and must conform at the end of the combat phase.
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Audentes fortuna iuvat.

AlanCutner · Post� le: Mar Oct 13, 2015 2:43 pm Sujet du message:

Thanks. This came up at a tournament last weekend. I'm relieved we gave the correct ruling.

Ramses II · Post� le: Mar Oct 13, 2015 10:23 pm Sujet du message:

I am not sure this is correct, perhaps others can comment.

"Unable to conform" (p54) specifically suggests that the inability to conform does not prevent the charge, and the second diagram even presents a situation where the charger is prevented from conforming by another friendly unit that is already in melee.

My understanding is that Unit X charges south into B, and that B subsequently conforms with X at the start of the opposing player's turn.

fdunadan · Tribun Inscrit le: 12 Juin 2009 Messages: 984

the "unable to comform" rule p54 is used when you HAD contacted the front of the ennemy unit who wasn't in melee.
the case here is p37 "illegal charge" (in the french book):
roughly translated:
"because of the différents sizes of the bases or the impossibility to align, the front of a unit already in melee may be contacted. it is forbidden to charge a unit already in melee on its frontby contacting it on this same front.. A move to bring a support or a charge on the rear or flank is authorized.

I have hignlighted the main rule. in the french book, there is a nice diagram with the very same case of yours.
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Audentes fortuna iuvat.

Ramses II · Post� le: Mer Oct 14, 2015 8:56 am Sujet du message:

Ah - my mistake. Embarassed

Thanks for the correction.

Hazelbark · Magister Militum Inscrit le: 12 Nov 2014 Messages: 1669

one of the great things about the translation. Page 37 says the very same thing in the English version with the very same diagram.