Art De La Guerre

Andy Fyfe · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 14 F�v 2024 Messages: 80

Hi Guys,

Hopefully a simple question about melee contact following a charge.

A Med SW charged a bowman and contacted the front at an angle meaning that only one front corner of the charging unit contacted the front (not corner) of the target unit.

Due to penalising terrain the Med SW did not want to conform to front to front contact.

Is this a valid contact for melee?

I know that corner to corner is not a valid contact but is corner to front a valid contact?

The consensus what that it was valid.

Andy

Hazelbark · Magister Militum Inscrit le: 12 Nov 2014 Messages: 1669

It is valid.

But to be clear, the terrain would have had to been difficult because rough does not penalize the MI.
And you cannot just choose not to conform, if full conformation is available without the listed exceptions.

It sounds like you are describing the diagram p53, right column middle, Unit B.

Andy Fyfe · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 14 F�v 2024 Messages: 80

Mike Bennett · Post� le: Mer Ao� 07, 2024 8:17 pm Sujet du message:

Is this response saying that you can remain in partial conformation without any actual edge contact? Ie front corner only contacting the edge, and still in melee?

Page 54 diagram “ambiguous conformation” is not exactly the same, but it does forbid corner to front edge contact. It does not allow the unit to remain there in contact by only a corner to avoid the penalising terrain, but requires it to align and accept entering the terrain.

Zoltan · Post� le: Jeu Ao� 08, 2024 6:29 am Sujet du message:

I find it helpful to think of it as a two step process:

1. Can the charger make a legal contact (any kind of contact)?

2. If yes, what is the correct conformation (which may be a temporary incomplete conformation).

Andy Fyfe · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 14 F�v 2024 Messages: 80

Andy Fyfe · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 14 F�v 2024 Messages: 80

Mike Bennett · Post� le: Jeu Ao� 08, 2024 9:48 am Sujet du message:

Mike Bennett · Post� le: Jeu Ao� 08, 2024 9:58 am Sujet du message:

NB: the paragraph starts “after conformation a unit must be clearly aligned….” Units at different angles to each other are not aligned.

1. Verb: place or arrange (things) in a straight line. “the desks are aligned in straight rows facing forwards"

Ps I appreciate that the intention might not be to use “aligned” as it is actually defined, but thems the words wots written. Without the authors / rules committee view we cannot know what was intended, only what is written. In any case needing sone edge contact, not just a single corner, seems perfectly reasonable to me.

Zoltan · Post� le: Jeu Ao� 08, 2024 12:47 pm Sujet du message:

I’m struggling to envisage the shape of the difficult terrain piece that prevents the charger conforming to the target (aligning/becoming parallel with) at least partially, following the initial front corner contact.

Mike Bennett · Post� le: Jeu Ao� 08, 2024 1:40 pm Sujet du message:

I have seen it where the target is in a gap between two terrain pieces

Andy Fyfe · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 14 F�v 2024 Messages: 80

Mark G Fry · Post� le: Jeu Ao� 08, 2024 4:01 pm Sujet du message:

This then raises a separate but associated question.

If the attacking unit of MF swd is not forced to align to the front edge of the Bowman, to avoid the penalizing terrain, what happens in the next bound?
If the Bowmen survives the initial melee, is it now forced to align to the front edge of the MF swd, thus putting its back edge into the penalizing terrain and fighting at a forced disadvantage. Which seems a bit odd.

Or are both units left to fight as they initially made contact, until the melee is resolved?
_________________
'He could have lived a risk-free, moneyed life, but he preferred to whittle away his fortune on warfare.' Xenophon, The Anabasis

navigator · Post� le: Ven Ao� 09, 2024 10:11 am Sujet du message:

P42 for a charge units must contact enemy ..even with a single corner...so the example has a legal contact.

Terrain means no conformation till next bound by the charge receiver .simples...

No need to over complicate things.

Neep · Prétorien Inscrit le: 09 Jan 2023 Messages: 298

I was looking at this the other day. I was surprised to realize that all friendlies can be shifted so long as they are not in melee. Smile

Now I've looked at the errata and realize why I was surprised - not all friendlies can be shifted. Embarassed

It is possible, by using impassible terrain, ongoing melees, and unshiftable friendlies, to construct situations where you can only make corner to edge contact, or even corner to corner contact.
I assume only corner to corner contact means the move is not allowed, based on the implications of page 51 Conforming units already in contact.
Corner to edge is moot. I'm with Mike that you must conform into penalizing terrain if it's possible, but if it it's impossible?