Jhykronos
Auxiliaire
Inscrit le: 02 Aoû 2015
Messages: 95
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 Posté le: Lun Nov 16, 2015 9:14 pm Sujet du message: Cumulative Special Abilities |
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Hypothetically, if a unit loses the first round of melee by a score of 1 on the dice, but has both better armor and missile support, would said unit then win the melee by 1?
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Hazelbark
Magister Militum
Inscrit le: 12 Nov 2014
Messages: 1669
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| Posté le: Lun Nov 16, 2015 9:19 pm Sujet du message: |
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| No because neither ability allows you to win, only to not lose. |
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Jhykronos
Auxiliaire
Inscrit le: 02 Aoû 2015
Messages: 95
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| Posté le: Lun Nov 16, 2015 10:25 pm Sujet du message: |
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| Hazelbark a écrit: | | No because neither ability allows you to win, only to not lose. |
Interesting, because the wording on both abilities is "add one to the die roll before determining the outcome of combat". Is there somewhere else that specifies that the die adjustment cannot change the winner? Or is this an established clarification? (It's a rare enough case that I doubt it has come up often).
BTW Hazelbark, a lot of familiar names on these boards 
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Hazelbark
Magister Militum
Inscrit le: 12 Nov 2014
Messages: 1669
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| Posté le: Mar Nov 17, 2015 3:07 pm Sujet du message: |
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In both cases the rule states the addition only applies if the unit loses the combat.
I could be wrong, but I think that intent is clear and very difficult to prove otherwise. |
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Jhykronos
Auxiliaire
Inscrit le: 02 Aoû 2015
Messages: 95
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| Posté le: Mar Nov 17, 2015 4:26 pm Sujet du message: |
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| Hazelbark a écrit: | In both cases the rule states the addition only applies if the unit loses the combat.
I could be wrong, but I think that intent is clear and very difficult to prove otherwise. |
Well, I agree it would be awfully strange that losing by 1 would net a better result than tying.
Maybe the best clarification would be that the post-roll adjustments are applied sequentially instead of simultaneously... so if your score is less, you apply the +1 for one reason, then if your new score is still less, apply the +1 for the other reason.
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Ramses II
Magister Militum
Inscrit le: 17 Juil 2015
Messages: 1236
Localisation: London
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| Posté le: Mar Nov 17, 2015 5:54 pm Sujet du message: |
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There is a difference between losing, tying, and winning, and determining the effects or outcome of that situation.
- Bonuses and deductions for certain Special abilities (Stakes, Impact, Impetuous, Javelin) Terrain and tactical situations etc are added before determining who has won, and indicate the extent of the win/loss
- Missile support, Armour, 2 Handed weapon and Furious Charge are applied after determining who has won, changing the potential impact to the 'loser'.
The fact that a unit loses the melee by -1, but has both armour and missile support changing the outcome to +1, just means that the loser does not lose a cohesion point, so the end result could be thought of as a 'losing draw'. |
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