Art De La Guerre

[Viking709]

A LMI bow unit is In ambush and 2 UD INSIDE edge of a gully. Unit of LH move up to edge of gully and can see into the gully. Do they see the LMI in ambush or do they have to move up to 1 UD?

[PHGamer]

1 UD

[footslogger]

As soon as you are within 1UD of the edge of the gully (not the ambush), the ambush is revealed (check the FAQ).

[fdunadan]

Nope.

the reveal of an ambush is only at 1 UD, whatever the terrain it is in. for example, if an ambush is in fields it is revealed only at 1 UD even if the visibility is not limited in fields.
So units deployed in a gully are visible by and can see enemy units when they are within 1 UD of the edge of the gully, but ambushed units can only be revealed if you come closer.
_________________
Audentes fortuna iuvat.

[footslogger]

[Ramses II]

I believe Footslogger is correct here.

The FAQ p10 states

[fdunadan]

the page 70 note means that :
either you have a clear line of sight on the ambush marker IN CLEAR TERRAIN (otherwise you would'nt be able to put ambushes in brush, fields or marsh that doesnt block the sight)

either you come close to 1 UD of the ambush marker

in the case of the gully, units in ambush have prepared their position, taking concealment and so and can't be seen as opposed to troops that juste are in the gully, marching or in battle order.

So i think that the "1 UD of the marker" rule applies to the ambushes IN terrain and the "clear LoS" rule applies to the ambushes in clear and BEHIND a terain.
_________________
Audentes fortuna iuvat.

[Ramses II]

Ok fdunadan, I think I can see where you are coming from, but this actually raises questions on how to reveal Ambushes in a Gully.

Essentially the FAQ is classing the terrain inside the Gully as similar to a 'field' which does not restrict vision. We agree that a unit can see into a Gully when it moves to within 1UD of the edge. At that point, if the terrain does not restrict vision, they should be able to see any troops that are not LI.

It sounds as though there ought to be a two stage process here, revealing standard troops when the unit can see into the Gully, and revealing any LI or removing the Ambush marker as a dummy when the unit moves to 1UD.

I will try to ask this question on the French forum - unless you get there before me

[footslogger]

The rules don't say anything about clear terrain (or at least I don't know where they do if they do). The quoted rules are about visibility. And there is no cover in a gully, so no restriction on visibility.

If it were about clear terrain you'd then have to clarify what do do about things like medium foot in fields behind hills. Visibility covers that, wording about clear terrain would not.

I guess I could see an argument for LI being able to remain concealed in a gully even when people have visibility to them (on analogy with fields) but nothing else.

And, once again, if it should be different from what's in the rules, put it in the FAQ, please.....

[Ramses II]

OK on the French forums, plefebvre has confirmed that all the units in the ambush are revealed when a unit moves within 1UD from the edge of the Gully.

Presumably the process is similar to the normal process of revealing ambushes, though I will confirm that with the French guys.

[Stephen]

[footslogger]

[Ramses II]

I believe he is one of the rules committee.

[footslogger]

[Hazelbark]

Have you been to this section of web?

http://www.artdelaguerre.fr/en/regles.php

There is one on gullies in particular.

Also note there is today a new FAQ as well.