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Black Prince
Prétorien
Inscrit le: 17 Oct 2016
Messages: 299
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 Posté le: Jeu Nov 04, 2021 5:41 am Sujet du message: Medium foot swordsmen vs two Levy |
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| With my early Samurai army I have a base of Medium foot swordsmen because I do not have the points to upgrade it to Samurai, its job is to sit behind the Samurai line and fill a gap when it appears. I have been thinking would I be better off buying two levy instead of the Medium foot base to increase my break points? |
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fdunadan
Tribun
Inscrit le: 12 Juin 2009
Messages: 984
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| Posté le: Jeu Nov 04, 2021 9:17 am Sujet du message: |
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Pro:
1) you get 2 units instead of one for your army's moral.
2) that's 6 cohesion points instead of 3.
Con:
1) Levy are not good in fight, they can just oppose LMI, LI ou LH. everything else will trash them.
2) they are bad in terrains.
so your choice. If you intend to stay in second line and exploit a support or fill a gap, Levy are useful.
If you plan to use your unit to fight choose the MI.
_________________
Audentes fortuna iuvat. |
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KevinD
Légat
Inscrit le: 23 Aoû 2021
Messages: 647
Localisation: Texas
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| Posté le: Jeu Nov 04, 2021 9:50 am Sujet du message: |
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| fdunadan a écrit: | Pro:
1) you get 2 units instead of one for your army's moral.
2) that's 6 cohesion points instead of 3.
Con:
1) Levy are not good in fight, they can just oppose LMI, LI ou LH. everything else will trash them.
2) they are bad in terrains.
so your choice. If you intend to stay in second line and exploit a support or fill a gap, Levy are useful.
If you plan to use your unit to fight choose the MI. |
Con:
3) Levy are more difficult (slower, need more CPs) to move. This is fine if they are in a static baggage defense role but awkward if they are accompanying your attack force to cover gaps or flanks and especially if they need to maneuver during a scrum to get to the gap or flank. |
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ethan
Signifer
Inscrit le: 12 Nov 2014
Messages: 354
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| Posté le: Jeu Nov 04, 2021 11:29 am Sujet du message: |
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| I essentially never buy levy in ADLG. |
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Ramses II
Magister Militum
Inscrit le: 17 Juil 2015
Messages: 1235
Localisation: London
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| Posté le: Jeu Nov 04, 2021 5:13 pm Sujet du message: |
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Pro, if you put the Levy behind fortifications to defend your camp, they are both hard to shift and add to the army size, allowing you to spend points elsewhere.
I would also consider using mediocre followers (MI Sw) for 4pts. Three mediocre MI Sw are the equivalent of two regular units, but unlike Levy they are not unmanoeuvrable and move faster |
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Hazelbark
Magister Militum
Inscrit le: 12 Nov 2014
Messages: 1669
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| Posté le: Jeu Nov 04, 2021 5:15 pm Sujet du message: |
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| Black Prince a écrit: | | With my early Samurai army I have a base of Medium foot swordsmen because I do not have the points to upgrade it to Samurai, its job is to sit behind the Samurai line and fill a gap when it appears. I have been thinking would I be better off buying two levy instead of the Medium foot base to increase my break points? |
So every time I have opted for Levy in v3 Sassanids and HYW French that could be mediocre MI, I have migrated away from Levy.
Levy just don't do the job. They are slow and they lose to just about everything. the MI can at least keep up or run into terrain.
I might consider Levy if it got me to say 20 instead of 19 units. But going from 21 to 22 is not worth it -- bad bulk is less desirable than people realize. |
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KevinD
Légat
Inscrit le: 23 Aoû 2021
Messages: 647
Localisation: Texas
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| Posté le: Jeu Nov 04, 2021 5:25 pm Sujet du message: |
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| Hazelbark a écrit: | | Black Prince a écrit: | | With my early Samurai army I have a base of Medium foot swordsmen because I do not have the points to upgrade it to Samurai, its job is to sit behind the Samurai line and fill a gap when it appears. I have been thinking would I be better off buying two levy instead of the Medium foot base to increase my break points? |
So every time I have opted for Levy in v3 Sassanids and HYW French that could be mediocre MI, I have migrated away from Levy.
Levy just don't do the job. They are slow and they lose to just about everything. the MI can at least keep up or run into terrain.
I might consider Levy if it got me to say 20 instead of 19 units. But going from 21 to 22 is not worth it -- bad bulk is less desirable than people realize. |
MI Sw Mediocre seem like a really good deal. Great hanging out in terrain (uphill in cover if possible) and good to hang out behind your line and close gaps or cover flanks. LMI Jav Mediocre can do the same thing for one point more, but then have the option to run away if it looks too scary. |
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Black Prince
Prétorien
Inscrit le: 17 Oct 2016
Messages: 299
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| Posté le: Sam Nov 06, 2021 6:21 am Sujet du message: |
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| Thanks for the input. Where possible I have always avoided mediocre troops, I will re-evaluate and try then out in some test games before a comp. |
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ethan
Signifer
Inscrit le: 12 Nov 2014
Messages: 354
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| Posté le: Sam Nov 06, 2021 1:28 pm Sujet du message: |
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| KevinD a écrit: | | Hazelbark a écrit: | | Black Prince a écrit: | | With my early Samurai army I have a base of Medium foot swordsmen because I do not have the points to upgrade it to Samurai, its job is to sit behind the Samurai line and fill a gap when it appears. I have been thinking would I be better off buying two levy instead of the Medium foot base to increase my break points? |
So every time I have opted for Levy in v3 Sassanids and HYW French that could be mediocre MI, I have migrated away from Levy.
Levy just don't do the job. They are slow and they lose to just about everything. the MI can at least keep up or run into terrain.
I might consider Levy if it got me to say 20 instead of 19 units. But going from 21 to 22 is not worth it -- bad bulk is less desirable than people realize. |
MI Sw Mediocre seem like a really good deal. Great hanging out in terrain (uphill in cover if possible) and good to hang out behind your line and close gaps or cover flanks. LMI Jav Mediocre can do the same thing for one point more, but then have the option to run away if it looks too scary. |
What I have found is that M Sw Mediocre are cheap, but really aren't that great at the job especially since mediocre h Sp in particular exist. H Sp mediocre is IMO still the "cheap troop" of choice. It is the least likely cheap thing to simply be overrun by mounted in one or two attacks (a serious risk for M Sw mediocre) and it can absorb more shooting (thanks to 4 cohesion). No it isn't very useful in terrainn, but the scenario in which you usefully sit on a hill in terrain with cheap troops is not one that actually happens all that often. The M Sw mediocre is also suprisingly vulnerable to LI Bow types shooting at them...As Hazelbark notes "bad bulk is less desirable than people realize" M Sw Mediocre are heading into that category. I will take them from time to time, but often find I would rather have a LI Bow instead which is more useful in more circumstances.
As |
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