Art De La Guerre

Jhykronos · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 02 Ao� 2015 Messages: 95

EBL
_M

Player 1 has elephant E and Bowmen B facing toward the top of the screen (the bowmen are shooting at someone there).
Player 2 manages to hit Bowmen B in the flank and rear with Medium cavalry M and Light Cavalry L.

Predictably, after combat, Bowmen B is gone and player 2 declines to pursue.

E_L
_M

Elephant E's rear corner is in contact with the front corner of Medium cavalry M, but is not currently in a ZOC.
What are player 1's option's on his next movement phase.

1. Can he conform the elephant into M for free (and its side into L's front), or does L's ZOC prevent this?
2. Can he spend 2 CP to turn around and charge M (same thing), once again possibly conforming his elephant's flank to the front of the Light cavalry?
_________________
- Let the Die be Cast

daveallen · Post� le: Ven Juil 23, 2021 3:18 pm Sujet du message:

The Elephant can

1) Make a move that takes it out of contact with the Medium Cavalry.

2) Conform to the MC. The MC would then have to option to evade.

3) Charge the LC by wheeling 90 degrees and making corner to corner with the LC.

It cannot charge the MC as units cannot charge enemy they are already in contact with.

Nor can it remain in its present position.

Dave
_________________
Putting the ink into incompetence

Jhykronos · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 02 Ao� 2015 Messages: 95

1) OK, that's clear
2) OK, but now the elephant has its flank contacted by the LC. And if the MC evade, then what? Do they get to conform again, or did they just functionally engage the front of another unit with their flank on their own turn.
3) OK, they charge the LC. The LC evade. Do they then conform to the MC anyway?
_________________
- Let the Die be Cast

MC_Delicatessen · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 30 Juil 2020 Messages: 87

What are the factors?

If the El conforms to the front edge of the MC and it doesn't evade, the El is contacted in the flank by the LC (right?).
So, the LC gets melee support +1. Both cav are at zero basic against the El. The El is reduced to zero because of the flank contact but gets the El panic - so evens.

And if the El wheels and charges the LC, if the LC doesn't evade, same equation, right? LC and MC are zero, El is zero, MC gets +1 melee support, cancelled by the LC elephant panic.

Is that right?

daveallen · Post� le: Sam Juil 24, 2021 5:46 am Sujet du message:

First of all, I have to say I've never seen this situation in any game I've played, but the new rule that these post melee contacts must be resolved is throwing up odd situations that do need looking at.

daveallen · Post� le: Sam Juil 24, 2021 5:54 am Sujet du message:

Jhykronos · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 02 Ao� 2015 Messages: 95

MC_Delicatessen · Auxiliaire Inscrit le: 30 Juil 2020 Messages: 87

Ramses II · Post� le: Dim Juil 25, 2021 12:40 pm Sujet du message:

Hi both. An interesting situation indeed.

However, I think the Elephant only has the options to move out of contact with the MC, or to conform with the front edge of the MC; attempting to charge the LC would move through the ZoC of the MC which must be respected under V4. That said, I agree with Dave's conclusions that the factors would favour the elephant, and also that both enemy units could evade.

daveallen · Post� le: Dim Juil 25, 2021 3:02 pm Sujet du message:

Za Otlichiye · Post� le: Mar Juin 21, 2022 6:39 pm Sujet du message:

I've been going through all the questions and this one brings up something I've been pondering.

Dickstick · Post� le: Mar Juin 21, 2022 10:47 pm Sujet du message:

As soon as the elephant turns it's in contact with the mc so doesn't it conform with the MC?

In the original option 2, doesn't the MC evade before any actual conforming is done and so the conformation stops there with an elephant about turn.?
Cannot confirm to someone who isn't there.
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Player 747 don't call me Jumbo

SteveR · Prétorien Inscrit le: 21 Mar 2018 Messages: 284

"attempting to charge the LC would move through the ZoC of the MC"

I dont see that. A turn would result in that, but the El could instead wheel 90 degrees to the right and then charge. They will not be in the MC ZOC and will make corner to corner contact with the LH and then conform.

Zoltan · Post� le: Mer Juin 22, 2022 1:12 am Sujet du message:

Za Otlichiye · Post� le: Mer Juin 22, 2022 4:00 am Sujet du message:

Dickstick, good point. But I think the sliding rules on page 41 and the fact that you cannot charge a unit you start in contact with, will allow you to slide right down the face of the MCav so long as the LH is, in fact, TMtE.

SteveR - absolutely you could strike the enemy that way. I am interested in the litigation of the TMTE rules, though.

Zoltan - I think this was all discussed in another early thread (I'm reading them through). You conform first, and the evasion happens, page 51. If they do evade there is no second conformation. You would fight a flank attack from the LH, which in this case would mean you keep your combat factor and your Panix; LH would get the Situation +1. So the LH may well want to evade anyway, which is another open question. Although I note when charged, any unit "contacted" may evade.