Art De La Guerre

[Zoltan]

I've been half-heartedly following this somewhat tortuous discussion and finally can't help myself. I really don't see what the problem is here.

The Second case on p.48 is a test for whether or not a unit is permitted to evade (having had a charge declared upon it). The unit is NOT permitted to evade if, following the unit's reorientation, any of the following are within 1 UD of its starting position AND these "obstacles" can not be avoided by a slide of 1 UD or less:

1. enemy units,
2. friendly units that the would-be evader cannot interpenetrate,
3. an impassable terrain piece.

A rough or difficult terrain piece within 1 UD of the would-be evader is NOT an obstacle that prevents an evade, and the evader is explicitly prohibited from sliding to avoid rough or difficult terrain - the evading unit MUST move in a straight line (per p.48 section 5) towards the rough/difficult terrain.

A combination of the terrain type, the unit's normal move, and the evade VMD will determine whether or not the evader actually enters the rough or difficult terrain, and how far into the terrain it progresses.

[Neep]

It is a bit disconcerting that an evader would stop at the corner of a village and be considered to have moved its full MA when it could have slid a UD sideways and continued on. Part of the answer is that it is an artifact of the simplified movement rules (some rules use movement rates over terrain) and part is that the intent of the rules is that evaders must move as far as they can while obeying the other evasion constraints.

===

The same issue can come up with impetuous (therefore unmaneuverable) troops. Impetuous Cv spends 1 CP to advance 1 UD to a Woods and stops as it has used up its in Woods MA. But the opponent objects because the Cv could 1/4 turn and move another UD and so should pay 2CP (either way). I don't think that's correct, but I've been surprised before.

[Zoltan]

[Neep]

Z, you need to review the OP whole-heartedly this time. The rules when less than 1UD are clear. The questions arise when the obstructions are 1+ UDs away.

[Ramses II]

The OP is an old red herring about evaders avoiding penalizing terrain, which has been discussed over many years. 

The answer is that the rules do not allow this, and while it may seem a good idea, “thems the rules”. 

Can we leave it at that please. 

[elsleyra]

As per the title of this thread, the original post was actually about whether or not an evading unit may execute a slide of up to 1UD in order to finish short of an extended obstacle. Much of the subsequent content of the thread was triggered by my error in not realising that terrain the evading unit does not have sufficient movement allowance to enter is not an obstacle.

There has been one response that addresses the key question from the original post

[Ramses II]

Use the diagram on P49 as your guide;
On approaching an obstacle, the unit may first slide up to 1UD, then wheel (up to 90 degrees). Both manoeuvres count towards the adjusted movement allowance (ie the wheel is 1.5UD).

[KevinD]

Interesting. I had read the slide and wheel as being mutually exclusive (though you could do a slide under step 2 and then a wheel under step 5). If you can clear the obstacle with a slide of 1 UD you do that, otherwise you wheel. (3rd bullet under point 5 on pages 48-49.)

[daveallen]

[Three]

https://www.artdelaguerre.fr/adlg/v3/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8845

This is the thread answering this question that I've got scribbled and highlighted onto page 48 in my rulebook.

It's consistent with what Zoltan and Ramses II are saying above.

on that thread, Zoltan said -

[KevinD]

What about chariots and difficult terrain?

Since chariots can’t enter this ever does it count as an obstacle that can be avoided or do chariots just stop at the edge?

I assume they consider it as impassable and just slide/wheel to avoid since they can never enter, is this wrong?

[Three]

That's getting discussed next door.

http://artdelaguerre.fr/adlg/v3/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10522

[Zoltan]

Remember there are two slightly different cases we are considering regarding the effect of terrain on a would-be evader’s move. The answer can be different in each case:

1. Am I permitted to evade or does something prevent this - how is my evade move affected?

2. Having started my evade I encounter a new “situation” - how is my evade move affected?

[daveallen]

Thanks Three, for the link and the explication. I see it was over three years ago and thus well outside my memory horizon. I'll make a note on page 48 too.

That said it really does hurt my brain that the rule about not avoiding things that aren't obstacles is included in a rule about not avoiding obstacles.

Wouldn't it be better if a simple statement that "evaders may not under any circumstances manoeuvre to avoid terrain they are capable of moving in." was placed elsewhere, say 5 - EVADE MOVE. Rather than have one specific case (less than 1 UD away after initial turn) included in a rule about obstacles.

And while I'm about it, there is this from the errata:

[Three]

Dave, I agree that the wording is not really consistent with the ruling, to be honest that's why I noted it at the time, as it continually crops up during games and I was arguing that a slide to avoid terrain was allowed.
Having said that, I agree with how it has been ruled, I just think having the wording tidied up would be beneficial.